@GC on raids from 12/12 raid leader

#1 - March 22, 2011, 6:10 p.m.
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First I want to say that in my guild there are 2 raid groups, one is a 10 man that is 1/13 HM and my 25 man which is 10/12 normal, but after 25's are done we take a 10 man group and kill Al'Akir and finally killed Nefarian on 10 this week also(to make my 10 man 12/12), and now that we have the tanking on phase 3 down on Nefarian we expect a kill of him on 25 this week and also Heroic Halfus(18% enrage wipe last week).

In my experience with this tier of content the largest issue is the number of mechanics per fight. The average person can only remember about 7 things at once (like a phone number), but some of these fights have so many components, on top of what you have to do normally (dps rotations, cooldowns, healing, etc.) that it pushes the number of things you have to remember per encounter to a degree that things get missed. Now this can be overcome with enough practice, but things getting missed brings me to my next point.

If something gets missed, it usually means a wipe - especially when learning a new encounter. These pass/fail mechanics make raiding disheartening when a single person can wipe the entire raid. Not everyone has the same learning curve and there will always be laggards in your average raid group. I know I have a few, but with enough practice they do eventually get used to the fight and then it is no longer an issue. Then when we go to start a new boss, those same few people are again taking a little longer than the rest to learn the fight, and their mistakes are causing the entire raid group to fail.

I do enjoy the t11 raids and their difficulty, and I do agree that the encounters are inherently not that difficult. The issue, I believe, is solely in the sheer amount of things that have to be done to perfection by everyone in the raid in order to get a kill.

This larger number of mechanics equates to longer times to learn a fight and slower progression overall. I really think this could have been alleviated in several ways.

Let me use Theralion and Valiona as an example.

In Grim Batol you get to fight Valiona, and the dragon uses the same breath mechanic in the heroic that it uses in the Raid. This is good as players are exposed to that mechanic and should be able to avoid it in a raid setting much easier. If one or both of her other mechanics were added to the fight (blackout and deep breath) then players would be further exposed to the raid mechanics before the raid encounter itself.

If there was a Theralion encounter that exposed players to some or all of his mechanics then players could learn those as well. Finally when you get to the raid encounter and you have to deal with both at the same time + 1 or 2 (ONE OR TWO, NOT 8+) new mechanics then the players would see much better progression.

Another possibility with the same idea in mind would be to make raid encounters halved. Again using Theralion and Valiona as a guide. You could have the choice as to whether to fight Valiona, Theralion, or both. If you choose just 1, then the loot is halved, but you can practice that 1 half of the encounter over and over to perfection. Once you have one down, you can then do the other. Once both have been learned you can start doing both. Again this is small steps of progress rather than the huge chunks we are forced into currently.

For final bosses, I believe they are where they need to be. They are complex, difficult, and fun - as a final boss in a raid should be. The real issue is the amount of time it takes to learn all the fights to get to the bosses. They have too many mechanics per encounter. My group has basically spent about the same amount of time to learn each new encounter with the exception of Halfus and Magmaw, and when it takes as much time to learn the sub bosses as it does to learn the final boss, then either the final bosses are too easy, or the sub bosses are too hard and I don't think very many people are saying the final bosses are too easy.

As far as fixing this issue now - there is really no good answer for this. The main thing I would suggest is to do better on future encounters. I posted in another thread about the possibility of a scaling ICC style buff that would reduce the amount of loot that drops if the buff is turned on, and also not allow for any achievements if the buff is turned on. Such a scale-able buff could be used by raid groups to learn an encounter more easily because pass/fail mechanics may not wipe the raid if they have increased health and healing. It could also allow for another level of progression as groups could possibly kill some bosses that they could not without the buff and slowly turn the buff down until it is off. Then they get more gear per boss and start obtaining the achievements. Also, for those that just want to see the content and are not really interested in the loot or the achievements, it would help to satisfy their desires. Lastly for those that don't need the buff, they will get their gear faster and their achievements.

In closing I just want to say that I am looking forward to the next tier of raids. I feel my group should be further progressed than it is now, but I am not upset over it (although some of my better members are to some extent). My group only raids about 10 hours a week and we have been able to get to this point with some hard work and dedication. We will progress into heroic modes before the next tier also, but doubtful we will be 13/13 before the next raid is patched in. We hope to be able to experience and progress in the next tier better than the current one, and look forward to trying.
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#4 - March 22, 2011, 6:16 p.m.
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In order to keep the discussion focused, we ask that you please post your thoughts to the original blog post to which you are responding (linked below), rather than creating additional threads on this topic.

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http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/2452061#blog