Shadow Priests: PvP Improvment Suggestions

#0 - Jan. 2, 2009, 8:08 p.m.

PRELUDE: This OP is being modified on a near daily basis due to the influx of suggestions that this topic is currently receiving; If the devs have read this OP and have taken interest in it, I urge them to take a look at it again from time to time to check for any updates.

LATEST CHANGES INDEX:

- Modified suggestion 1 (passive touch of weakness) to resolve a potential PvE abuse issue with it.
- Modified suggestion 7 to include Bacchanal's simple but effective fix for shadowfiend issues.
- Removed suggestion 12 which related to the mind flay not ticking properly issue. This has been tentatively fixed.
- Modified and clarified suggestion #3. Priest would be able to self heal only based on number of Vamperic Embrace charges tied to him (suggestion #2)

INTRODUCTION

Though there have been notable improvements to shadow priests overall since 3.02, most people would agree that shadow priests have continued to lack in PvP aspects and especially now with all the burst damage around, in survivability.

The following list of suggestions have in mind 3 Objectives:

I) Reducing "Loading Time" (Explanation Quoted from Twistt) - (Suggestion #2)

Our damage is poor mostly due to the long "loading time" on spriest damage. We have good dps in PvE, but in PvP, we have to get 5 stacks of shadow weaving and 3 dots up on a target, just to do equivalent damage to other classes. This has always been the design intention of shadow, slow starters, but in the end they get brought up with the rest, which unfortunately has huge drawbacks in pvp.

II) Addressing DOT Dependency (Explanation Quoted from Twistt) - (Suggestions #2, #8, #10)

Along with the "loading time", the dots are far too susceptible to being removed. Couple that with Vampiric Touch having a cast time and Devouring plague having a hard cooldown, and its really hard to get any good amount of damage going before they are removed or wiped from the target, not to mention they are taxing on the mana pool to recast over and over. You might say just use mind blast and SW:Death, but we lose 10% damage on mind blast and 20% damage on mind flay by not having our SW:Pain up, and we lose a lot of our mana efficiency by not having our Vampiric Touch up, not to mention, a lot of our damage was balanced around our dots, so we really need to be using them.

III) Increasing Synergy - (Suggestions #1, #3)

I currently have two suggestions that help increase the synergy within the talent tree.

The following suggestions, even if ALL were implemented, would probably not suffice in addressing all our survivability issues BUT they would definitely be a step forward in taking spriests in the right direction, especially against melee.

Ghostcrawler

#225 - Feb. 3, 2009, 6:08 a.m.

We have some PvP-oriented changes in mind for Shadow. We hope to be able to announce them soon.

Ghostcrawler

#268 - Feb. 3, 2009, 11:54 p.m.

Q u o t e:
When I see a response like this, I'm 90% sure that GC didn't read the original post in its entirety. Didn't agree, disagree or even COMMENT on anything that was written. Probably just read the title, skimmed through it and provided the unoriginal "We intend to buff shadow priests in 3.1!" response.

I read all of the threads here. I don't have the bandwidth to go line by line evaluating every suggestion. Even when I do that, it is pretty common for the player who made the suggestion to want to challenge our logic or otherwise expect additional back and forth discussion on the topic. Don't get me wrong -- that would be awesome. But I just can't have that level of discussion with every player out there. :(

It is fairly common for us to make changes only to be greeted by "But we made all these great suggestions and you didn't implement any of them." Almost all of the time that is going to be the case, particularly when you consider the volume of suggestions that the community offers. I try to discourage players from using these forums with the expectation that their ideas will make it into the game. It happens, but it is rare.

That is not to say we don't value suggestions. We do. They can be great at helping us to understand what the problem is that the suggestions is trying to solve. Sometimes we do like the solution offered and end up going with an idea that somebody suggests. However, one thing that I think the community doesn't always give us enough credit for is that we think about the problems in the game all the time. Often even the most original suggestions to appear on the forums are ideas that we have already considered and rejected for some reason or another.

Ghostcrawler

#292 - Feb. 4, 2009, 5:01 p.m.

Q u o t e:
Then GC tell us what you feel like needs to be implemented to make Spriest viable in PVP.

We think Shadow priest damage is good in PvE and PvP, minus a few annoying bugs. We think the problem is that Shadow priests just can't survive long enough to do damage. That is a combination of some classes doing too much damage, but also Shadow defenses being too weak.