Ret Paladins and Spiritual Attunement

#0 - Jan. 7, 2009, 11:59 p.m.
Blizzard Post
Just before I get into my big long post on SA mana returns for Ret, I’d like to ask GC what is the status on the Prot 11 point talent / Ret buff we were promised during one of our hotfix nerfs? It was hinted in this post (http://blue.mmo-champion.com/5/12065281480-upcoming-ret-paladin-pvp-nerf.html) that it was a possibility and later confirmed in another post that I can’t find on Blue tracker.

Anyway on to my Wall of Text! Paladins are experiencing a large difference in mana returns in different environments. PvP we can run out of mana easily. PvE can shift from one extreme to the other depending on AoE damage, healer coverage and fight length. One of the major contributors to this inconsistency is Spiritual Attunement.

Spiritual Attunement was brought in at the start of BC to allow all paladins to tank. It allowed Prot pallies to regen a lot more mana reliably. It was made baseline so Holy and Ret can tank in 5 mans, off tank if needed and such. At one stage overheals were counted in SA but were soon nerfed due to making Holy never run out of mana with its synergy to Shadow Priest abilities. Otherwise SA didn’t really affect those 2 specs in non tanking situations because health values were low and the AoE damage wasn’t that intense. Now in WotLK that health values have grown the returns are more substantial.

On fights that have a lot of AoE damage we can see a lot more mana returned than normal. In a fight like Sapphiron (Lots of constant AoE damage) we can get a lot more mana returns than a fight like Patchwerk (Only tank and OTs take damage). The problem is at the moment SA returns are too good to turn down. Art of War (Instant FoL on certain ability crits) was brought in to let Paladins manage their self damage. But at the moment with the mana returned from SA it’s easier and often better to let healers cover it.

As well it is often good to step into a survivable AoE damage effect to receive more returns from SA. Players should be avoiding AoE and not jumping in it. Then again I’m of the mind that AoE should punish the DPS and not the healer (i.e. AoE reduces their damage by x% and not causes damage to them).

Take the following WWS reports for example. The returns on SA for 3 fights (Patch for Non AoE, Grob for mid AoE and Sapp for Max AoE).

http://wowwebstats.com/rqiwul%*!kx4q?m

Confessor
Patchwerk: 3k
Grobbulus: 7k
Sapphiron: 18k

http://wowwebstats.com/55sfrcpfd6eny?m

Rockdwg
Patchwerk: 1.7k
Grobbulus: 5.2k
Sapphiron: 19.3k

Elewd
Patchwerk: 3k
Grobbulus: 4.3k
Sapphiron: 20.5k

http://wowwebstats.com/nhpuekb2baya5?m

Trajer
Patchwerk: 4k
Grobbulus: 11.2k
Sapphiron: 19.2k


In PvP though we can’t rely on SA because we often team with another DPS or you are forced to heal yourself more often (To reduce pressure on the healer) which does not add to SA returns. This can leave us starving for mana. With the current fast paced, over quickly Arena this isn’t a large issue yet. But as games get longer the issue will get bigger.

What I would like to see done to fix this is to lower SA down to 5% of healing done to mana instead of 10% that it is currently. Buff Judgements of the Wise up to 20% or 25% to balance it out. Prot would have Improved SA functionality attached to an existing talent. I'd suggest 1 handed weapon specialisation. Which could become Holy Body or something. Names aren't important. Holy would get either Illumination slightly buffed or something new added to their tree as well.

I’m not going to say my way is the way to fix it. My fix is probably very flawed and not right. My fix isn’t the point here. SA returns are inconsistent and promoting bad play (By wanting to be hit by some avoidable AoE). I just wanted to raise the issue for Blizzard to look at. And please don’t just nerf SA. All specs are affected by this ability so if one gets a change they all need an equal change.
#14 - March 14, 2009, 1:12 a.m.
Blizzard Post
Spiritual Attunement is a great mechanic for a tanking paladin who needs the mana and gets it from taking damage.

For other paladins it just complicates balance. On Patchwerk you get no mana from it as Holy / Ret and on Sartharion it gives you just a ton of mana. So you're either bone dry on one fight or drowning in mana on another, totally depending on raid damage.

The best knob we have for tweaking Ret mana return is to up Judgements of the Wise from 15% to 20% or whatever it needs to be. (Holy has Illumination.)
#209 - March 15, 2009, 12:39 a.m.
Blizzard Post
Q u o t e:
GC... you do realize that everyone in the paladin community is taking this as a promise you will buff jotw, right?


Such is my lot in life. We need to get some numbers for Ret mana after all of these changes and make a call at that time. I was just pointing out that we have plenty of knobs to tweak to balance the class without SA.

Remember, the goal here is not to nerf Ret mana. It is to make it more stable instead of varying wildly depending on the encounter. While encounters will always be different to some extent, when you look at the mana provided by SA on different fights, it can be pretty extreme. Ulduar balance is going to be tricky because we want the normal encounters to still be accesible to most raiders while the hard modes need to be balanced on a knife's edge. Having so much variation is just going to get in the way of that.

The Seal of Blood glyph will most likely have to be changed to accomodate this change.