Feedback: Demon Hunters

#1 - Aug. 25, 2022, 12:41 a.m.

In this thread, please respond with your feedback on the updated Demon Hunter class, once you’ve had a chance to test it out in the Dragonflight Alpha.

Thank you!

#2 - Aug. 25, 2022, 12:42 a.m.

After 10,000 years… today’s build includes early versions of Demon Hunter’s class and Havoc talent trees.

The class tree houses many of the familiar utility and defensive abilities associated with each spec and arranges them in spec-themed sections to the left (including modifiers to Fury and movement speed) and right (including Brands and options to empower them), with shared damage bonuses centered (including The Hunt and modifiers to Metamorphosis). We hope to see players take advantage of the new talent system to make choices that match their preferences, that can be tailored to meet the challenges they will face, and that create new gameplay opportunities by combining effects in ways not previously possible.

The Havoc tree takes abilities from the spec’s past and present, then puts them alongside reworked and all-new talents to provide multiple gameplay and damage output styles to invest in. Notable among them are talents that provide incentives for secondary stats like Critical Strike Chance and Mastery, as well as talents that grant significant bonuses to the skills of your choice like Chaos Strike, Eye Beam, and Immolation Aura. We hope the new trees provide opportunities to make talent builds that feel custom and distinct.

While we’re still working on the Vengeance specialization, we wanted to bring the Class & Havoc trees online so we can get community feedback as early as possible. The Vengeance tree currently in this week’s Alpha is the existing Shadowlands’ talent tree, in addition to containing all of their other abilities. This is placeholder and not indicative of their final tree, and we will be bringing the Vengeance tree online as soon as its ready. Regardless of whether you’re checking out these Demon Hunter class and Havoc talents online or trying them out in the Alpha, we hope you’ll enjoy and share your thoughts with us!

• Known Issues
  • There are several talents that are not fully implemented yet. These are tagged with NYI (Not Yet Implemented) in their Talent name.

#4 - Aug. 25, 2022, 2:23 a.m.

Glide is indeed intended to trigger Momentum’s effect.

That said, the duration of Momentum’s effect is currently stacking like it does on live realms and that’s unintended. It will be changed to be a refresh in a future update.

#48 - Aug. 26, 2022, 10:52 p.m.

TLDR - Glide will be removed as one of Momentum’s trigger skills in a future update.

Thank you to those willing to discuss Glide’s inclusion as a potential trigger for Momentum. While we knew it could be a controversial addition, player discussion around the topic has helped paint a clearer picture of the ways in which it could be fun and also the ways in which it could cause problems or frustration. Most reactions to Glide on Momentum were negative, and ultimately we agree that the downsides would probably outweigh the benefits and Glide will be removed as a potential trigger skill.

Momentum has historically been very divisive, with many players strongly loving or hating it. A talent tree is an ideal system for such an ability to exist, as an option. With that in mind, a capstone position puts a greater emphasis on Momentum than it should have, and so Momentum will be swapping positions with Essence Break. Essence Break will be modified in a way to further emphasize its intended identity as a medium cooldown controlled burst option.

Your continued feedback on Demon Hunters in the Alpha test is greatly appreciated and helps guide future iteration. Cheers.

#52 - Aug. 27, 2022, 12:07 a.m.

We agree to the extent that a 2nd charge of Fel Rush (and for Vengeance, Infernal Strike) should be more easily accessible than in its current position on the Havoc spec tree, and so the talent Hot Feet will be moving to the class tree in the first row center position where the talent ‘Master of the Glaive’ is now.

Master of the Glaive’s effect will be combined back into the talent ‘Debilitating Cuts’ and renamed back to ‘Master of the Glaive,’ matching the Shadowlands talent version.

#55 - Aug. 27, 2022, 12:55 a.m.

A new talent modifying Throw Glaive will be taking its place, the details of which will be available in a future build.

While on the topic of talent placement and what talents go where, we’ve been following discussions and planning changes. Instead of responding to every current related comment, you can refer to the below image to see what Havoc’s tree is likely to look in the next update:

image528×579 105 KB

We really do appreciate your continued play, discussion, and feedback, and we hope you will continue to share it with us as we move forward. Cheers.

#100 - Sept. 1, 2022, 7:02 p.m.

Today’s build includes the final spec talent tree to be updated to its Dragonflight version: Vengeance Demon Hunter.

The Vengeance tree allows players to customize their offensive and defensive gameplay to conquer the game’s challenges as they see fit. Talents include opportunities to unlock familiar skills like Spirit Bomb and Elysian Decree, to choose bonuses for core skills like Demon Spikes and Sigils, and to invest into spec systems like Soul Fragments and an expanded/reworked ‘Frailty’ debuff exclusive to Vengeance talents.

In additional to the talents themselves, there are two notable changes to the base function of Souls and Soul Fragments. The first change is that non-demon Souls and Soul Fragments will require more precision to pick up manually, now requiring moving within 4 yards (down from previous 6 yards) with the intention that the circumstances where players accidentally pick up Fragments will occur less frequently. The second change increases the radius that nearby Soul Fragments will remain available for consumption via skills to 100 yards (up from previous 25 yards).

We hope you’ll enjoy your experiences with the new Vengeance spec talents, and be willing to provide feedback about those experiences with us!

#122 - Sept. 3, 2022, 2:20 a.m.

This is a concern we’ve heard echoed from many sources and have been thinking about as well. When it is one legendary choice among many and contained to a limited window of time as with the Shadowlands version, the divergent rotational gameplay required by it can be novel and appropriate. But we are less comfortable carrying that gameplay forward as a more permanent talent choice, and will be testing a slightly modified talent version of Burning Wound that intends to streamline gameplay and solidify an identity as an effect that is at its best in low target count scenarios.

So, the following adjustments are currently planned (and as always, are subject to change):

• Burning Wound DoT applied by Throw Glaive (was Demon’s Bite)

• Burning Wound DoT damage reduced by 25%

• Immolation Aura bonus damage on Wounded targets reduced to 45% (was 65%)

• May be applied to a maximum of 3 targets

This updated talent version will be available for testing in a future update, and we’re hoping you’ll try it out and let us know what you think. Cheers.

#235 - Sept. 8, 2022, 6:09 a.m.

Thank you for sharing about your experiences thus far. <3

#279 - Sept. 10, 2022, 1:02 a.m.

How do you do fellow Demon Hunters,

We wanted to tip you off to some changes that will be present in an upcoming build, as we’ve seen discussion around these topics, and want to provide additional context for continued discussion since it helps guide future iteration.

First up is the feedback we’ve heard surrounding Vengeance’s Mastery: Fel Blood, which increases the armor granted by Demon Spikes. While there are (very intentionally) talent options available that can increase Demon Spikes uptime and therefore influence the relative value of Mastery for a character, two problems remain:

1. The starting value of the Mastery stat is drastically lower than other secondary stats

2. Mastery has no value while Demon Spikes is not active, further reducing incentive to invest in it as it does not help survive the moments of greatest weakness, as where other stats would

As a result, we’ve decided to softly rework Vengeance’s Mastery

What does this mean? While Demon Spikes is active, Mastery: Fel Blood will provide the same bonus per Mastery as it did previously, but now with 50% of that value persisting while Demon Spikes is not active.

As always, we welcome discussion about this upcoming change, and will be on the lookout for that as well as gameplay feedback when the updated Mastery makes its way into player hands on the PTR and Beta.

Now, on to the topic of Metamorphosis, talents that affect it on the Demon Hunter class tree, and some spec-specific changes related to it all. Here are the most relevant notes:

• Metamorphosis base CD standardized at 4 min
• Rush of Chaos still reduces CD by 60 sec, to 3 min for both specs
• Havoc’s Metamorphosis duration reduced to 25 sec
• Demonic Origins now reduces CD by 60 sec (reaching 2 min CD for both specs), no longer reduces duration, and now causes Metamorphosis to grant 10% Versatility while active

We hope the above will result in the cooldowns and talent options available for Metamorphosis making a little more sense as to what circumstances players might consider picking them, regardless of what spec perspective it’s being viewed from.

Moving on to Havoc, there are two topics to discuss. First, the talent Fel Bombardment (which was previously not yet implemented) has been removed from the tree. While many former Legendary or conduit effects have been able to transition to forms you’ve seen as Dragonflight talents for many classes, we have decided we do not want the particulars of Fel Bombardment’s gameplay cemented as a more permanent talent and will be leaving it in the Shadowlands. Mo’arg Bionics will be moving into its place, with a new Throw Glaive-related talent appearing near the top of the tree:

Finally, as a brief follow-up to a previous topic, Demon’s Bite/Demon Blades will be returning as skills that can apply Burning Wound, alongside the previously-added Throw Glaive. Thank you to those who played the updated version and shared feedback about your experiences.

Cheers.