Greetings,
If you have feedback, issues, or questions, please use this thread, based on this post:
https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-April-15-2014/3896049
Please do not create duplicate posts, as it makes it more difficult for us to gather your feedback in a timely and organized manner. Thank you for your understanding.
PS: I am deeply concerned no moderator has yet to appear here to intervene. That no developer has peaked in to aknowledge some of the concerns brought up here.
The thread was doing remarkedly well for a long time, which is why it had little interaction from the Moderation Team. There has been plenty of debating, only a tiny bit of off-topic, which quickly got back on track.
We saw the first reports about this thread this afternoon. Thousands up thousands of posts are made every single day and although we wish we could review them all, it’s just not physically possible, so any assistance we can get from players using the report function is greatly appreciated.
All this said, we have cleaned up the thread. Please keep it on-topic and clean. Thank you!
Thanks everyone for giving us some feedback on this system we’ll meet internally and discuss this system some more as I think there are a lot of valid points being brought up here.
Hey all,
I see a lot of people talking but with a thread this long the details are often muddied by a large number of similar but differing opinions. I want to address some of the more straightforward stuff.
Trait Tier level increase. We made this change because despite what the more hardcore players like myself want, most players need to be introduced to systems more slowly so that they don’t get lost. Every time we overwhelm new players that is an opportunity for them to stop playing the game. Every time that happens it becomes harder and harder for new players to develop into longtime players. Without more longtime players it becomes hard for you and your current guilds to meet and find people to replace those who inevitably will be pulled away by real life from time to time.
Unlocking traits. We talked about this a bunch in the horizontal progression CDI and it came to our attention that many players were not learning about traits, how they worked, or understanding the options. When we talked through unlocking traits via activities it led us in the direction we have currently. Unfortunately, unlocking traits in the open world generally causes one of the #1 things we never wanted in the game which is players in conflict. You want might the Balthazar trait but someone is about to complete the chain and leave you waiting. This is bad for the game, but I think right now only occurs this dramatically for a few of the traits.
If you all list out the most offensive ones here we would be happy to look into changes given that we have already done so in the past when we switch many of the poorly placed map complete adept tier traits among a few other changes. Here is a list of those changes:
• Profession Trait 13: This trait is now awarded upon preventing the Statue of Lyssa from being re-taken by the Risen, as well as defeating the corrupted high priestess of Lyssa.
• Precision Adept Trait 5: This trait has been moved from Bloodtide Coast map completion to the defeat of Sharky the Destroyer in Arca Lake of the Harathi Hinterlands.
• Precision Adept Trait 6: This trait has been moved from Fireheart Rise map completion, to the defeat of Captain Jayne in the Brigantine Isles of the Gendarran Fields.
• Toughness Adept Trait 6: This trait has been moved from Iron Marches map completion, to the defeat of the Giant Blood Ooze in the Challdar Gorges of the Bloodtide Coast.
• Vitality Adept Trait 5: This trait has been moved from Timberline Falls map completion, to the defeat of Gargantula, the spider broodmother in the Wynchona Woods of Harathi Hinterlands.
• Vitality Adept Trait 6: This trait has been moved from Mount Maelstrom Map Completion, to the defeat of the Krait Witch in Timberline Falls.
• Profession line Adept Trait 5: This trait has been moved from Sparkfly Fen map completion, to the defeat of the Champion Ice Wurm in Lornar’s Pass.
• Profession line Adept Trait 6: This trait has been moved from Frostgorge Sound map completion, to the defeat of Lord Ignius the Eternal of Lornar’s Pass.
At the end of the day this system has helped spread out the teaching of the system and the feeling of accomplishment through acquisition, but it has done it in ways that are sometimes counterproductive and still not nearly visible enough to impact as many players as it could.
Guild Wars 2 is a game that is going to continue to evolve and it will be because of your feedback and our efforts so do not get discouraged from posting feedback and be patient with change and I hope we will reward that patience.
TLDR;
We added this system as a direct result from the horizontal progression CDI. We are always reading your feedback, however, we don’t always have time to respond right away or action it quickly. We updated some trait unlocks in the past but we can do more. How can you help?
1) Give us a list of the most offensive trait unlock locations.
2) Keep giving feedback and be patient as this is a big ship and it takes time to steer it.
List of things I dont like
-Map completion
-Personal Story
-Overgrown grub
-WvW objectives
Thanks. I’ll pass this on.
I know this sounds like a no-brainer, but:
Don’t you think a well developed, clear and concise tutorial would have at least curbed some of the issues you have with new players “understanding” the game, instead of changing the core game pacing?This. So much this.
Actually not. Generally speaking tutorials are hard to implement, boring for experienced players and overwhelming for new players. The best tutorial is a system that slowly puts the content out to players because it gives experienced players something to achieve while reducing complexity and option shock for new players.
For all those posting specific feedback. Thank you it is very helpful.
Thanks. I’ll pass this on.
So, this is how it works? Cherry pick ONE PERSON’s “list of things I don’t like”, while ignoring 40 pages of really good feedback and ideas? OK. I’m done with this thread.
From this response from JonPeters and his initial post it is obvious that Anet is not going to fix their new leveling process or trait system except the individual tasks themselves.
I’m discouraged since I used to like leveling new alts but can live with just playing my level 80s instead.
To be clear we are looking at the system as a whole but recognize that changing that will take longer than is satisfying and are looking for ways to improve the current system until a time at which we can make a better overall system from the ground up. Specific suggestions on what traits are poorly placed are helpful for #1, specific suggestions on #2 are also welcome but are going to be read but not responded too right now.
Thanks. I’ll pass this on.
So, this is how it works? Cherry pick ONE PERSON’s “list of things I don’t like”, while ignoring 40 pages of really good feedback and ideas? OK. I’m done with this thread.
From this response from JonPeters and his initial post it is obvious that Anet is not going to fix their new leveling process or trait system except the individual tasks themselves.
I’m discouraged since I used to like leveling new alts but can live with just playing my level 80s instead.
To be clear we are looking at the system as a whole but recognize that changing that will take longer than is satisfying and are looking for ways to improve the current system until a time at which we can make a better overall system from the ground up. Specific suggestions on what traits are poorly placed are helpful for #1, specific suggestions on #2 are also welcome but are going to be read but not responded too right now.
So, if I’m reading this right, are you saying, you’re looking for quick changes to make the system more bearable while not confirming or denying the possibility of a holistic revamp at some point in the indeterminate future?
Because knowing that would really settle some of my anxiety about the existence of this request for feedback.
Yup. and I would replace the word possibility with the word probability…
Thanks. I’ll pass this on.
So, this is how it works? Cherry pick ONE PERSON’s “list of things I don’t like”, while ignoring 40 pages of really good feedback and ideas? OK. I’m done with this thread.
From this response from JonPeters and his initial post it is obvious that Anet is not going to fix their new leveling process or trait system except the individual tasks themselves.
I’m discouraged since I used to like leveling new alts but can live with just playing my level 80s instead.
To be clear we are looking at the system as a whole but recognize that changing that will take longer than is satisfying and are looking for ways to improve the current system until a time at which we can make a better overall system from the ground up. Specific suggestions on what traits are poorly placed are helpful for #1, specific suggestions on #2 are also welcome but are going to be read but not responded too right now.
Thank you, that is nice to hear.
Please be more honest and straight-forward like this in the future.
To be fair, we love being this honest and straight forward normally though it just ends up sounding like a bunch of talk and not a lot of walk and that is because it takes time to be this active on the boards. After today I’ll be a bit less “forum active” again but that means I am working on making the game better.
This thread is very large and has a lot of great feedback and input within it. But because it’s so long, some participants may have missed a very informative post by Game Design Lead Jon Peters.
To help you help us with a topic that the devs feel is very valuable, I’ll repeat Jon’s post:
Hey all,
I see a lot of people talking but with a thread this long the details are often muddied by a large number of similar but differing opinions. I want to address some of the more straightforward stuff.
Trait Tier level increase. We made this change because despite what the more hardcore players like myself want, most players need to be introduced to systems more slowly so that they don’t get lost. Every time we overwhelm new players that is an opportunity for them to stop playing the game. Every time that happens it becomes harder and harder for new players to develop into longtime players. Without more longtime players it becomes hard for you and your current guilds to meet and find people to replace those who inevitably will be pulled away by real life from time to time.
Unlocking traits. We talked about this a bunch in the horizontal progression CDI and it came to our attention that many players were not learning about traits, how they worked, or understanding the options. When we talked through unlocking traits via activities it led us in the direction we have currently. Unfortunately, unlocking traits in the open world generally causes one of the #1 things we never wanted in the game which is players in conflict. You want might the Balthazar trait but someone is about to complete the chain and leave you waiting. This is bad for the game, but I think right now only occurs this dramatically for a few of the traits.
If you all list out the most offensive ones here we would be happy to look into changes given that we have already done so in the past when we switch many of the poorly placed map complete adept tier traits among a few other changes. Here is a list of those changes:
• Profession Trait 13: This trait is now awarded upon preventing the Statue of Lyssa from being re-taken by the Risen, as well as defeating the corrupted high priestess of Lyssa.
• Precision Adept Trait 5: This trait has been moved from Bloodtide Coast map completion to the defeat of Sharky the Destroyer in Arca Lake of the Harathi Hinterlands.
• Precision Adept Trait 6: This trait has been moved from Fireheart Rise map completion, to the defeat of Captain Jayne in the Brigantine Isles of the Gendarran Fields.
• Toughness Adept Trait 6: This trait has been moved from Iron Marches map completion, to the defeat of the Giant Blood Ooze in the Challdar Gorges of the Bloodtide Coast.
• Vitality Adept Trait 5: This trait has been moved from Timberline Falls map completion, to the defeat of Gargantula, the spider broodmother in the Wynchona Woods of Harathi Hinterlands.
• Vitality Adept Trait 6: This trait has been moved from Mount Maelstrom Map Completion, to the defeat of the Krait Witch in Timberline Falls.
• Profession line Adept Trait 5: This trait has been moved from Sparkfly Fen map completion, to the defeat of the Champion Ice Wurm in Lornar’s Pass.
• Profession line Adept Trait 6: This trait has been moved from Frostgorge Sound map completion, to the defeat of Lord Ignius the Eternal of Lornar’s Pass.
At the end of the day this system has helped spread out the teaching of the system and the feeling of accomplishment through acquisition, but it has done it in ways that are sometimes counterproductive and still not nearly visible enough to impact as many players as it could.
Guild Wars 2 is a game that is going to continue to evolve and it will be because of your feedback and our efforts so do not get discouraged from posting feedback and be patient with change and I hope we will reward that patience.
TLDR;
We added this system as a direct result from the horizontal progression CDI. We are always reading your feedback, however, we don’t always have time to respond right away or action it quickly. We updated some trait unlocks in the past but we can do more. How can you help?
1) Give us a list of the most offensive trait unlock locations.
2) Keep giving feedback and be patient as this is a big ship and it takes time to steer it.
~~~~~
Jon also wrote later than he would need to be a bit less active on the forums but he explained that this meant he was actively working on making the game better.
So as Jon asked, please keep your feedback coming with our thanks for your efforts to also make the game better! Please note that as Jon points out, changing systems or making adjustments takes time and careful review, but you are being heard and your input is valuable to us.
I think the point of her doing that was to make sure those who haven’t been following the thread closely know that there is some dev interaction/acknowledgement on the subject.
Yes!
Gaile’s comment makes it sound like the idea all along was that horizontal progression applied to those leveling – rather than at end game. That bothers me A LOT.
Perhaps you mean Jon’s comments? For I said nothing whatsoever about progression, horizontal or otherwise. Just want to make sure you didn’t read something into my words that reference leveling, progression, or anything of that sort.
~~~
Anyway, thanks for the input added today. And I mean that, especially because I recognize some of you are irritated and would like to post like that one guy who shouted! 
The reason I re-posted Jon’s comments involves some level of confession: I saw this huge thread in the forums, kept reading across many sub-forums and posts that ArenaNet was being asked to provide some sort of response, wanted to get you some info (although I knew it wouldn’t be much at this point), sent an e-mail to some devs to ask about how we could respond, then met up with Jon who pointed out that he’d put up a pretty comprehensive post … that I had completely missed.
If I missed it, maybe someone late to the thread missed it, so hence the repeat or re-post. Not to say “share your ideas” if you already have! Not to give a placating “there there” or meaningless non-update. But because I honestly felt that some forum member may have missed the update and input request from the dev team and they may want to provide new feedback.
So you guys who posted last month or two weeks ago or when the thread started? You’re good. Got it, thank you, and really, thank you again if you patiently re-posted today. To you folks who are saying “You need to update that thread,” please note that right now, the only update we have available in the one that was offered – in detail and at length – when Jon last posted. He or another team member will update when they have more info, but do know this thread was and continues to be useful.
